Saturday, October 19, 2024

Now the Urim and Thummim is forbidden?

Even the term "Urim and Thummim" is being de-correlated.

It was one thing for our scholars to ignore what Joseph and Oliver said about the translation when they wrote the Gospel Topics Essay on Book of Mormon Translation. 

While it seems unthinkable that such an essay would not begin with quoting what Joseph and Oliver said, and even more unthinkable that the essay would completely ignore what they said (apart from a few misleadingly truncated excerpts), at least the essay used the term itself (although in a misleading way).

https://www.ldshistoricalnarratives.com/2022/09/analysis-gospel-topics-essay-on-book-of.html

The latest trend seems to be to ban the term itself.

For example, Elder Nash spoke at Scripture Central's "Moroni Day" i September 2024 and misrepresented what Joseph supposedly "referenced."


17:15 please note the following. without punctuation without strikeouts this was dictated word by word as he used what he referenced as to as the spectacles, at  times the searstone, [except Joseph never "referenced" or said he used a seer stone] using a hat to Shield his eyes from extraneous light in order to plainly see the words as they appeared

https://youtu.be/Oy8j4u97bso?t=1050 

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On the Come Back podcast, Casey Griffiths (BYU professor) again edits Oliver Cowdery's statement to avoid using the term Urim and Thummim and interpreters:

Original Source (omitted text in red)

Griffiths’ version

I wrote with my own pen the entire Book of Mormon (save a few pages) as it fell from the lips of the Prophet as he translated it by the gift and power of God by means of the Urim and Thummim, or as it is called by that book, holy interpreters.

 

I beheld with my eyes and handled with my hands the gold plates from which it was translated.

 

I also beheld the Interpreters.

 

That book is true.

 

Sidney Rigdon did not write it.

 

Mr. Spaulding did not write it.

I wrote with my own pen the entire Book of Mormon save a few pages as it fell from the lips of the Prophet Joseph Smith as he translated by the gift and power of God

 

 

 

I beheld with my eyes and handled with my hands the gold plates from which it was transcribed

 

 

 

That book is true

 

 


https://youtu.be/bshmVO3Mr4o?t=2181


Tuesday, October 15, 2024

The Interpreter's Witnesses film

The Interpreter Foundation is promoting its latest film, Six Days in August

https://witnessesfilm.com/

Because I don't live in Utah or Idaho, I haven't seen it.

Let's hope it is more faithful and historically accurate than their Witnesses film.

In the pursuit of charity, we assume everyone at the Interpreter acts with good intentions. They are certainly entitled to believe whatever they want, and they can promote their beliefs freely. 

In the pursuit of understanding, we seek to understand their reasoning and we have no compulsion to change their minds. It seems like they are trying to reconcile and rationalize what David Whitmer said about the translation (SITH, or the stone-in-the-hat narrative) by converting SITH into a faithful narrative.

That's the most charitable explanation I can think of. If someone has a better explanation, send it to me at lostzarahemla@gmail.com.

In the process, though, the Interpreter ignores what Joseph and Oliver said about the translation. As Joseph himself explained, "as plain as word can be," when he responded to ongoing confusion about the translation, in the Elders Journal in 1838.

Question 4th. How, and where did you obtain the Book of Mormon?

Answer. Moroni, the person who deposited the plates, from whence the Book of Mormon   was translated, in a hill in Manchester, Ontario County, New York, being dead, and raised again therefrom, appeared unto me and told me where they were and gave me directions how to obtain them. I obtained them and the Urim and Thummim with them, by the means of which I translated the plates and thus came the Book of Mormon.

(Elders’ Journal I.3:42 ¶20–43 ¶1)

https://www.josephsmithpapers.org/paper-summary/elders-journal-july-1838/11 

In the pursuit of clarity, we note that those who watched Witnesses may recall its portrayals of SITH, which are bizarre and counter-historical, to say the least. The film teaches that Joseph and Oliver misled everyone about the translation of the Book of Mormon, for example. It misrepresents David's trip to Fayette, omits the encounter with the messenger taking the plates to Cumorah, and much more.

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Here are some stills from the movie to give you an idea.

They spent about 3 full minutes relating the goofy narrative attributed to Martin Harris, which wasn't published until years after his death, and was based on a conversation he had with Edward Stevenson on the train to Utah. Shortly before the trip, Martin had fallen in a field and was delirious. Whether the stone-swapping account was the product of a dream, a delusion, or an actual memory is impossible to tell, of course, but the narrative never made sense.

And yet, to the scholars at the Interpreter, Martin's stone-swapping story is so important that it consumes 3 minutes with lots of shots on different locations, all in a film that is only 103 minutes long.

Look at these stills to get an idea of how ridiculous the whole narrative is.


Here the Interpreter scholars present their own narrative that repudiates what Joseph and Oliver always said about the origin of the Book of Mormon. Neither of them ever once stated or implied that Joseph used anything other than the Urim and Thummim that came with the plates.

Joseph using SITH to produce the Book of Mormon. We wonder what purpose the screen served if the plates were covered and the Urim and Thummim was not being used.


Martin Harris finds a rock by the river

Martin Harris puts the rock in his pocket


Martin Harris swaps his river rock for the "seer stone" that supposedly provided the words for Joseph to read.

Joseph Smith is supposedly duped by Martin Harris' river rock

One of the craziest parts of the film appears near the end.

This endorsement of David Whitmer's honesty was published a year after his pamphlet An Address to All Believers in Christ, in which David Whitmer related SITH, claimed Joseph was a fallen prophet, that there was never any Priesthood restoration, etc.

Anyone can read that pamphlet here:

Not surprisingly, the SITH sayers are fond of quoting this pamphlet for David Whitmer's account. Few LDS realize what else David claimed in the pamphlet.

While we give the Interpreter the benefit of the doubt and are fine with them believing and promoting whatever they want, we also recognize that the whole SITH narrative is an appalling refutation of what Joseph and Oliver clearly taught.

But it's all in fun, apparently, for our popular LDS scholars.




Now the Urim and Thummim is forbidden?

Even the term "Urim and Thummim" is being de-correlated. It was one thing for our scholars to ignore what Joseph and Oliver said ...